Deuterium Depletion Powerful Health Hack for Energy, Cancer Prevention, and more, with Dr. László Boros Part 2

Ari Whitten: As I was thinking about it after our first podcast, and I’d emailed you this, as what prompted this whole discussion of doing the second podcast, but it occurred to me that when we’re looking at these parts per million numbers of, let’s say, refined sugar, and let’s say someone consumes five tablespoons of pure refined sugar every day, and you can look at the parts per million and say it’s 155 parts per million of deuterium, and then you can compare that to, let’s say, 145 parts per million of water.

Then when you figure in the absolute amounts of grams of the substances that we’re consuming, so let’s say it’s five tablespoons of sugar over here, whatever that works out to be, 70 grams of carbohydrate, at 155 parts per million. Let’s say it’s- I don’t know, whatever the math works out to be, 1,000, however many thousands of deuterium atoms. Then if you consider that you compare it to just plain water consumption at 145 parts per million, slightly lower, but, instead of 70 grams of that substance, you’re consuming 1,000 or 2,000 or 3,000 grams a day.

The actual amount of deuterium atoms that is being poured into the body each day is 10 times, 50 times greater just from drinking plain water than it is from any particular food source. My question to you is, if we’re going to look at specific foods and look at their toxicity in that regard, wouldn’t this model, this way of looking at things, means that plain old water consumption is the most toxic thing of all because that’s adding the most deuterium atoms to the body?

Dr. Laszlo Boros: You’re right in that argument. This is actually a very interesting new area of studying, simply because, if you drink water excessively, meaning that you don’t feel thirsty, you just drink it as a habit, you turn or down-regulate or dismantle the process that we called antidiuretic hormone synthesis, which actually helps some mitochondrial health very much. Our urine production, you actually use about 800 liters, which probably use about 200 gallons of primary filtrate in your kidneys a day, and it’s reabsorbed into the circulation to kidney tubules. Those are deuterium-depleting processes, but actually there is a threshold that you cannot really exceed as far as loading deuterium in your system.

Once you exceed these thresholds, there’s even a worse thing that happens. I’ll give you an example. Let’s say your biochemistry or biochemical reactions can filter out 140 ppm from water into urine. I’m just giving you an example, 140 ppm water or 130 ppm water that makes sure if you drink it moderately or when you’re thirsty, then there’s no deuterium that gets into your mitochondria. If you drink 140 ppm water excessively, you actually increase your deuterium dramatically simply because not only your scavenging mechanism is failing, but practically the amount, if you multiply with the deuterium content of the water that you’re drinking, you’re actually exceeding biological threshold or filtering processes very, very dramatic, and that can be as you mentioned, very accurately, that’s a very good argument.

That can actually cause mitochondrial damage and in tissue-specific mitochondrial damage as you can develop diseases which obesity, cancer, diabetes, Alzheimer’s, these degenerative diseases, those are all part of this process simply trying to fight off deuterium that is arriving from water, mostly because excessively drinking water has one of those bad side effects. I agree with that.

Ari Whitten: Now, this is where the whole landscape gets really muddled to me because, on the one hand, there are many health experts out there recommending for you to drink more water and noticing beneficial effects of drinking more water.

There are many studies that have shown, that have linked, for example, low consumption of water with a mild state of dehydration, impaired brain performance, impaired mood, increased risk of various diseases and I’ve seen studies I can cite studies on the podcast page related to that for anybody interested.

Even more directly to this, there are other people talking about deuterium, who- and deuterium’s role in health, who have the opposite advice as you have. For example, Jack Kruse. He’s also talking about the importance of keeping deuterium levels low, but he’s a huge advocate of drinking lots and lots of water. You’re saying that we should keep deuterium levels low, but in order to do that, we need to be careful with our water consumption and not drink too much.

It seems to me that one of you guys has to be wrong in this story, and I don’t know which one it is, but it just- Yes, something doesn’t make sense here.

Dr. Laszlo Boros: Is this about water consumption or this is about deuterium? I think we agree on deuterium somewhat.

Ari Whitten: Yes, you and Jack Kruse agree on deuterium, but you have totally opposite recommendations with regards to water consumption.

Dr. Laszlo Boros: My argument is practically just like anything else, just like anything else, your body has the ability to control urination and water intake and food intake. That’s why I hunger, that’s why I thirst. That’s why these feeds, that’s why these hormones are established or are actually working in our physiology to actually control these processes.

I don’t see any reason to drink water if you’re not thirsty. Your thirst is there to show you or signal to you that you have to drink water.

I’ll give you an example. You only see animals drinking when they are thirsty. The lions, they are actually laying close to the lake for four hours simply because they’re just digesting their food. They only drink when they’re thirsty. I have not seen any other species both from drinking consuming water excessively without any cause or any reason or having diseases, population diseases, the amount or the scales and the nature of what we have now as human populations.

Truly water is a very precious resource, obviously, even if it’s not available, drinking water or the consumption of water is regulated just like urination, meaning that you do it in certain periods when you have a need for it.

Antidiuretic or ADH is very important because it can be the excessive water intake, you can actually shut down its production. I’ll give you an example. In the American population now, the average ADH serum level is about point six. The normal level would be one, meaning that actually the general American population is actually suffering from a disease called diabetes insipidus when you don’t have enough antidiuretic hormone to regulate your water intake and your urination.

If you drink excessive amount of water, you urinate excessive amounts of water and simply this is not what nature invented for you. This is not why your thirst is based on antidiuretic hormone levels is signaling to you when you do need to drink water and even it tells how much water you should drink because your thirst goes away once you have consumed enough amount of water.

Usually, animals let’s say, predators, they only go once or twice to drink simply because, for them, it’s very dangerous because that’s where predators gather, at water consumption, because you are actually exposed to an open area. It’s usually a group activity of animals, so water consumption is-

They don’t have bottled water. Just because humans have bottled water, and it’s not a challenge to consume it anymore, it does not mean that you should consume it simply because it has some effect, and which are undesirable from the endocrinology point of view.

If you look at this data, what’s the average antidiuretic hormone level in the American population? You’re going to see that actually it’s in the disease range, almost. It’s like diabetes insipidus in a large scale. That is true of–

Ari Whitten: To be fair, is an antidiuretic hormone affected by more than just water consumption? I think it has to be because, let me– Well, I think there’s a lot of legitimacy to what you’re saying, but here’s how I would break this down. Yes, it is genuinely the case that it is possible to have excessive water consumption and harm to health, you can cause hyponatremia. There are athletes that die from hyponatremia as a result of excessive water consumption.

It’s the case that if someone consumes two or three gallons of water, clean water right now, in the next five minutes, they can cause permanent brain damage and put themselves in a coma or even die from drinking too much water.

It is also the case, though, that there’s research showing that low levels of water consumption is linked with increased risk of disease, and while I agree that it’s definitely something that’s regulated, there are studies that have shown impaired athletic performance, impaired energy levels, impaired mood, impaired cognitive performance, measurable levels of impaired performance in those areas, before the person actually feels thirst. There seems to be this kind of area that someone can be slightly dehydrated before feeling thirsty. I think it’s a complex area.

Dr. Laszlo Boros: Yes. Again, if you drink water excessively, then you just like you kill your beta cells to produce insulin, you can kill your hypothalamus cells to produce antidiuretic hormone. It takes about six months to build the ability to produce antidiuretic hormone again, which again, has a very strong and very important effect of mitochondrial functions.

If you run a study on someone who does not have yet the ADH to be adjusted, to participate and respond to water withdrawal appropriately, then you’re going to have the side effects and I agree with you, if you can select your disease or study population carefully, meaning that you actually primed these patients or these subjects to be able to produce ADH, then even with low water intake, you’re not going to see these negative effects simply because your body knows how to regulate sodium, potassium, and other salts and atoms and inorganic chemical substitutes in your plasma simply because that’s one of the other roles that ADH or antidiuretic hormone and other hormones do.

It’s pretty much like giving sugar to a patient who has not build the ability to produce insulin. You don’t cut water intake in patients who don’t know how to produce or don’t have the ability to produce antidiuretic hormone. If you prime them with gradually lowering their water intake and you actually prime them to be able to produce ADH or in those studies, you would get a very different outcome.

Ari Whitten: Got you. One of the other areas that I was thinking about after our first podcast is, so you were talking about avoiding excessive water consumption. I think you mentioned something to the effect of you don’t drink water either at all or you drink very small amounts of it and you drink mostly olive oil based on that the fat will be produced into metabolic water by your mitochondria. Is that accurate?

Dr. Laszlo Boros: That’s accurate. I do drink water when I’m thirsty. I follow nature’s rules. If I had enough fat and if I don’t exercise, if I don’t walk the dogs, if I don’t do my push-ups, if I don’t challenge myself with physical exercise, then there are days that I don’t have to consume water simply because I had or eaten enough fat or had enough oil in my system that produces metabolic water.

If I’m thirsty, the first thing I do is just to drink a small amount of water that cures my thirst because that’s what my body signals to me that my ADH hormone signals with some other in collaboration with other hormones, it just signals to me that you need to drink water. I would certainly drink deuterium depleted water because that’s what our body’s trying to produce. The amount is practically a half a glass simply just to see how much of that water cures my thirst.

Ari Whitten: But aren’t water molecules required for beta-oxidation for using fats for fuel. Don’t we have a net loss of water through the course of the day and even as a result of consuming food unless you’re consuming really water-rich food? Isn’t it still a net loss even if the water that is being produced is deuterium depleted metabolic water?

Dr. Laszlo Boros: Yes. Let me answer your first question first because, in the mitochondria, in tri-copacetic acid cycle, we all constantly recycle water. That’s what the fumarate hydratase, that’s what the isocitrate, the hydrogenase does. They actually recycle water in the mitochondria.

Your metabolic water 7200 litres of eight or 2000 gallons of either day, that’s the amount of water protons are recycled in the mitochondria.

In mitochondria, there’s another process that is occurring and this is actually entering this scientific argument [unintelligible] rapidly is what we call is the quantum destabilization of protons or water. This is practically how you’re in the mitochondrial nano confinements or very tiny spaces in the mitochondrial cristae or crista.

There is actually a spontaneous water between those hydrophobic membranes, there is a spontaneous disassembly of water into hydrogen protons and hydroxyl groups. The protons tend to go to this quantum distabilization which means that they actually go into a wavelength or wavelengthy type of is called the zero-point energy state, they go into a more of a quantum state where actually they can produce a lot of particles for example photons.

I heard in your excellent podcast that you are light and photon related research expert, and I would like to give this argument to your excellent reasoning about light that actually photons can be produced at the zero-point energy level because protons can actually participate in quantum physics or quantum reactions in three different ways.

One is the delocalization which we use in MRI, the other one is zero-point energy which actually makes these protons to go into more like a wavelengthy or more like a quantum state and in tunneling, meaning that protons can actually bounce each other and they can actually tunnel in biochemical systems.

In mitochondria those are all very significant especially when it comes to the research of this exclusion layer water, which definitely exists. We don’t call it a fourth phase of water, but because of hydrophilic hydrophobic surfaces handle water molecules differently, water structures are differently around different surfaces. That research is very important–

Ari Whitten: This is something I– I’ll let you finish your thought if I’m interrupting but I want to come back to Gerald Pollock’s work and connect some dots there.

Dr. Laszlo Boros: Yes, I’ll finish just very shortly. When it comes to water in the TC cycle, water runs the TC cycle. We only need to drink water simply or eat food to keep the water in the mitochondria protonated so there are extra protons there that can be processed with oxygen into water. That kind of continues to run the TC cycle.

Practically, the amount of water we lose in the form of hearing or breath is probably in the two or three-litre range a day. From food, we can produce proton and hydrogen-based oxygen, reduced oxygen or metabolic water and we need to drink water as well, but that’s guided by thirst. This is why our physiology and biochemistry is just so related to disturbed urination, sleep, hunger, these are all regulated in a very in a connected manner.

Ari Whitten: Got you. Maybe I’ll save Dr. Pollock’s work for a second. This podcast is interesting for me because you’re such a biochemistry expert and I’m such a big-picture kind of person that I– let me put it this way, I have seen just so many cases where speculation based on physiological or biochemical mechanisms turns out to be just totally and completely wrong when you actually test it in a meaningful way.

I’ve seen so many theories over the years. People can say leptons do this at the molecular level therefore, all foods containing leptons or disease-causing, but then when you actually look at the data, we know that foods that are rich and leptons are decidedly associated with good health.

Or you can say insulin is the main thing that makes you fat. Therefore, the only way to lose fat is to restrict carbohydrates, but then when we test equal calorie diets that are lower high carb at equal levels of calories, they cause the- and different levels of insulin, they result in the same exact amount of fat loss. I could give you 20 other examples of evaluation based on biochemical mechanisms turns out to be dead wrong when you actually put it to the test in terms of real-world human health outcomes.

Dr. Laszlo Boros: Exactly.

Ari Whitten: I’m genuinely fascinated with this whole topic of deuterium. I think there’s some impressive research, especially around the deuterium depletion in the context of cancer treatments.

However, when we’re arriving at things like restricting water intake or perceiving water to be toxic, or that we need to consume– we need to avoid protein and carbs and eat a diet that is really very, very unlike kind of everything we know from nutrition research and the best diets that are associated with longevity and disease prevention. For example, from the Blue Zone data from best randomized controlled studies.

In other words, you’re like some of the conclusions that were arriving at from extrapolating from these deuterium related mechanisms seem very much at odds with what we know from the best nutrition data on long term health outcomes associated with how should we eat.

Given again, my background with seeing so much of the mechanism-based speculation turning out to be wrong, I am wary of that being the case here as well.

Dr. Laszlo Boros: We are not speculating. We are measuring the team levels. We actually look at biochemical scenarios and we are not restricting water. If you’re thirsty or anybody’s thirsty, they have access to water. Restriction water is practically if you don’t allow anyone to drink water and hydrate their system which is regulated by physiology. What you’re talking about is excessively consuming water. That’s a very different scenario.

Ari Whitten: Yes, I agree.

Dr. Laszlo Boros: I’ve never said that don’t drink water if you’re thirsty, I never said you don’t keep water around because [unintelligible]. What I was saying is that wait for your physiology, for your body to signal just like for many other things, if you are sleepy, then you go to sleep. If you’re thirsty you drink– you’re not going to go to sleep in the middle of the day when you’re not sleepy. Well, you’re not going to go to the restroom, to urinate when you don’t have to urinate, but for some reason, you drink water excessively, even when you’re not thirsty.

When you look at those studies, and you look at those arguments, those could be positioned from a different view simply because me as a biochemist, me as a physician, myself as a scientist, we go step by step. We actually look at data. We don’t come up with hypotheses that are just hanging in the cloud. We actually test those hypotheses and we look at data and when we make an interpretation to make it available for the scientific community, and for everybody, for that matter, just to comment and to challenge those proven hypothesis.

I hear you yes, there are many different– and I can give you another set of studies which fall like in the invalid scenario or invalid category after all. We actually do test hypotheses, we actually look at data to reject or keep hypothesis and you can research is actually databased. It’s actually science-based and published information most of us so we don’t have to guess around them practically because there’re original contributions and data. There are papers actually show the medical positioning of deuterium in controlled clinical studies.

I know now the internet and interconnected ways of expressing opinions or putting out some ideas without data, those will crumble simply because there’s no studies, there’s no hypotheses, there is no experiments. There is no experts, there’s no interpretations.

I’m not saying only experts should generate hypothesis, but I think hypothesis should be tested, and opinions should not be just discredited based on just some intellectual contributions, those have to be data-driven. Those have to be experiment-driven. As far as deuterium testing goes, it’s actually in the data scenario, it’s very strong and very established.

I wouldn’t say this is more like a guessing game. There’s a lot more evidence and a lot more data to show how important deuterium depletion is and I hope the clinical work that we are pursuing, and I’ve heard that you’ve been talking to some physicians about cancer and deuterium depletion. That’s what holds. I would not discredit deuterium simply because so many other ideas fail. I think this is here to stay.

Ari Whitten: Yes, got you. No, my intention is definitely not to discredit it. I’m just saying like the– I think, as a general rule, I’m very wary of relying too much on just the biochemical mechanisms to extrapolate that out to strategies at the big-picture level.

I’ve just seen so much nonsense that turns out to be wrong. I’ve seen people say, for example, like, cortisol is terrible for you and sugar suppresses cortisol levels, therefore– For example, in the AP method of eating, we need to consume adequate amounts of sugar to suppress cortisol because that keeps our physiology in a good state and yet we also know from much better control, the consumption of refined sugar is decidedly associated with bad health. What sounds good on a mechanism level turns out to be not so good with [inaudible]

Dr. Laszlo Boros: If you follow my media communications or social communications, I never comment, and I never come out with anything that is not data-driven. Also, I stay away from arguments that are not scientifically timely or positioned or tested or discussed well, meaning that it’s really truly a process that I prefer to pursue and follow for deuterium research.

The other important thing is that I’m trying to take deuterium into the standard medicine. It’s in the biohacking phase right now because people would like to use it, they understand the importance of it. That’s why we do studies now because we want to make this a mainstream medicine.

We want to make this as a medicine to be able and be available at the doctor’s office, fit very clear by a chemical, translational and clinical data and evidence-based medicine, which I do know that’s one of your main missions, doing this podcast to find evidence-based medicine or evidence behind the data or the arguments that are discussed in your excellent show.

I would just like to contribute to it. I would just like to point out the workflow and the steps we take not to be a guessing game anymore.

Ari Whitten: Yes, yes. I thank you for the work you’re doing. I think it’s incredibly-

Dr. Laszlo Boros: Thank you so much.

Ari Whitten: -important. I know we’re a little over time, but I have– Geez, I have a bunch more on my list, but I’ll try and narrow it down to just a couple things. If you have maybe 10 more minutes to spare?

Dr. Laszlo Boros: Sure. Sure.

Ari Whitten: Thank you.

Dr. Laszlo Boros: No problem.

Ari Whitten: One thing that I know has come up a few times in some discussions I’ve been involved in is the role of molecular hydrogen and the role of the relationship of that to deuterium, and there’s people using molecular hydrogen as a supplement or hydrogen water. I’m just curious if that has any relationship to deuterium in the body.

Dr. Laszlo Boros: Yes, so we don’t know what the source of the hydrogen gas that they use in the center so I don’t know. I wouldn’t comment under deuterium content. If there is excessive deuterium because hydrogen can be oxidized into water and I don’t really know what kind of deuterium content is in water I guess.

Ari Whitten: That’s interesting. Your interpretation of this is different from actually what I was thinking. You’re more talking about deuterium contamination or deuterium levels in the actual hydrogen tablets. What I was referring to is like, assuming it’s pure hydrogen and not deuterium, what would it be doing and how would it interact with deuterium at the cellular level?

Dr. Laszlo Boros: If that’s the question is if it’s pure hydrogen, the oxygen and hydrogen is supposed to meet in the mitochondria and oxygen is carried in hemoglobin where one of the oxygen bonds is available. If you hydrogen in your plasma or you actually drink water with hydrogen, hydrogen joins oxygen very rapidly. It’s called exposing gas because it’s just such a rapid reaction in chemistry.

I think hydrogen pills or hydrogen saturated water soaks up oxygen ability to deliver its function in mitochondria. That’s the biochemistry argument, so that’s the argument of the biochemist.

If it’s just pure hydrogen, then it depletes deuterium in your system, in your body. If that’s the case, and I could answer this question based on data, I don’t really have data and I don’t know what the source of the hydrogen, if it’s high deuterium or higher a higher in deuterium, then the water or the food that you’re consuming that is not good.

If it’s low in deuterium, you may have some beneficial effects and I’m just not arguing it’s not, I’m just as a biochemist, I’m just saying that it has to be looked at from all different angles and scenarios and certain time can be spent on it but it’s interesting thought.

Ari Whitten: The thought hadn’t even crossed my mind about the deuterium levels in like the hydrogen tablets. It’s quite a, quite a thought to think what if you’re supplementing with hydrogen and really it’s actually rich in deuterium.

Dr. Laszlo Boros: Yes. What they do is they use electrolysis. They electrolyze water or they use it from hydrogen deposits or hydrogen compartments. I don’t know the source and I don’t know the deuterium content, but if it’s high in deuterium, and we know in the industry, they use hydrogen gas for saturation process that are high in deuterium and that’s why the products are high in deuterium, yet with data we could answer this on a more comfortable basis, but I think, after all, it would be that deuterium content that would be an important topic to discuss.

Ari Whitten: Well, to anybody listening who’s involved in hydrogen supplements, I would be interested to see if they could send some of those samples to your lab to test the levels of deuterium in there, in the hydrogenated water from their supplies. That would be very interesting to get those levels.

Another unrelated question from a friend of mine, she was asking– She heard from her doctor that IV vitamin C, she’s undergoing some treatments for melanoma right now. She’s working with some doctors who are involved in deuterium depletion, and they said something about IV vitamin C being country indicated in the context of deuterium depletion. Do you know any or use of deuterium depleted water or something like that? Do you know anything about that interaction?

Dr. Laszlo Boros: Again, vitamin C can balance six protons, right? The chemical structure of vitamin C, it’s actually proton, it’s a protenating compound. If [unintelligible 01:08:21] a scavenge deuterium in mitochondria, if the source of vitamin C is a high deuterium source, then it can interfere with the deuterium depletion process in your body. If it’s a natural source, and it’s low in deuterium, so it’s not pharmaceutical-based or not industrial processed vitamin C, it may have a different effect.

The only reason I’m not commenting on this in more detail is because the effect of vitamin C is so complex in the plasma, in the cell, the cytoplasm and in the mitochondria. It can actually get into the mitochondrial membrane space. It is actually very complicated, very total process and actually can bind protons and deuterium can be also be a structure that binds to vitamin C.

I would not give medical advice on this particular scenario but I think, after all, natural ketogenic diet depleting deuterium water is a more safe, again, I’m not saying it’s better, to more safe approach to address disease progression in cancer.

This is the scientist’s point of view. I’m a medical biochemist, I do advice based on or I do express opinions based on medical biochemistry arguments. I’m also professional scientist in that sense. I’m not a clinical practitioner but a professional practitioner, meaning

that I answer questions that are research-related or not settled yet.

Vitamin C is not at the phase based on deuterium content and based on these other arguments simply what’s the source, what’s the dose, what’s the deuterium status of the patient, what kind of diet and what kind of deuterium depleting water scenarios there are. I think after all, the safest ways to drink deuterium depleted water and eat a natural ketogenic diet to address those cancer progressing type of questions.

Ari Whitten: Excellent. Well, I know we’re way over time here. Thank you so much for your time with me. I would love if we could wrap up this part two with just kind of your top two or top three tips on a more practical level to help people keep their deuterium levels low. Also, maybe challenge you to throw in something about Dr. Pollock’s research around fourth phase water and maybe how that ties into the story.

Dr. Laszlo Boros: Yes. Again, deuterium depletion is a very important part of life. Simply that’s what your body is trying to accomplish with all these biochemical reactions. Without going to details, the best way to help your body in this quest is to deplete deuterium from the outside. That includes food and water.

To be in good health, good spirit and the good prospect to look in your future, you want to look at deuterium always simply just to see how it can be depleted in an efficient way.

Metabolic and structured, interfacial and exclusion zone water those are very critical, very important part of research right now. I truly admire the type of work that Dr. Pollock is doing because simply he’s looking at a certain type of water which we don’t call a full phase of water. We call it a structured water with different chemical and different physical chemistry and we kind of know why the water molecules close to the surface, hydrophobic or hydrophilic surfaces behave differently than full water.

It has very important applications especially in mitochondrial health. Protonated water, Zundel and Eigen type complexes are very important of structuring water. Structuring water without deuterium has very important role in proton quantum destabilization, which are very important part we believe of Biology and Cellular Physiology.

Just to sum it off after all, keep watching because with more data, we can make more total and more clinically feasible arguments. This is how deuterium depletion, hopefully, will become standard medicine that can be obtained to doctors’ orders simply because they understand these mechanisms.

Ari Whitten: Yes, absolutely. Dr. Boros, thank you so much for your time today. Thank you for the work you’re doing. I really appreciate it. I’m sure that there are many people’s lives who are already being positively affected by it and will be affected by it in the future. Thank you for that work.

If somebody wants to reach out to you or get their deuterium levels tested or start to learn how to deplete deuterium levels, do you do consultations like that? Do you want to– Feel free to let people know how to reach you and how to work with you and so on.

Dr. Laszlo Boros: I do consultations. I do scientific consultations. I do consult with physicians and patients through physicians because I don’t give advice to patients directly, but I do answer their scientifical science related questions. I do the same with doctors.

I work for UCLA. I’m a professional scientist and in that sense. I get many questions. If you have something to discuss about deuterium or hydrogen, you can go to the website called laszlogboros.com and there you can see the type of services that we deliver.

If there is a clinical scenario, then I usually direct them to anyone of our Dr.Shoffner or Dr. Patrick Osmond. They are natural [unintelligible 01:14:36] practitioners who can actually advise patients on deuterium depleting scenarios.

They are excellent colleagues and partners and they are excellent contributors to learn about deuterium depletion in the clinical setting and the clinical scenarios.

They have the positive and they have the advantage of getting feedback back from patients directly. I don’t because I don’t work with patients. I depend on these great doctors, and there are many others obviously who I work with, but in the Los Angeles area, they are Dr. Shoffner, Dr. Osmond. They actually do work closely with us.

Simply, looking at the science aspects just go to laszlogboros.com or if you have a clinical question you can address it to me and I will direct you to the appropriate medical practitioner. Other than that, it’s academics scientists and translational clinical type of complex work in and information delivery surface that we hope eventually will serve better health in the general population.

Ari Whitten: Beautiful. Dr. Boros, thank you again so much for coming on the show and thank you for the work you’re doing really. A pleasure and as I said at the end of the first show, I think you win the prize for most fascinating, most weird and interesting topic, I think, that’s ever been discussed on this show. Thank you so much. I really appreciate it. This was this was a lot of fun.

Dr. Laszlo Boros: Thank you so much.